Transcript #13

Transcript #13

David Vastbinder

welcome back to the Carpentry Australia podcast

my name is Matty

and I’m here today with the great

David Fastlander from DPV Construction fantastic

and you’ve been a member with us for quite some time

you know you were one of our sort of founding members many moons ago

and do you remember why you first

sort of got involved with us in the first place

I think it was just that finally it is a sort of a

someone to help us with our industry

and I think with carpentry it’s

it’s just loose like it is

we need help

and I think Carpenter Australia is there to to solve that need

when did DPV start

and sort of take me through your apprenticeship and you know hey

I know you’re a registered builder now

so how did you get to that sort of stage

yeah so we started way back in like 2011

and a lot of that was when I was still apprentice

so but so start right at the story

so I sort of finished school and in 2007

and then from there I went to university

and with the mindset always wanting to be a builder

so I’m having a university degree once I finish school

it’s kind of help me being able to run a business

or go work for someone I wasn’t quite sure where I’d head there

but at least I thought I’d knock that over

and then I went and did an adult apprenticeship

so I think with that doing adult apprenticeship later in life

a lot of people sort of thought well

you’ve changed industries changed career paths

but my intent was always to be in construction

so and I think by doing a second

it kind of gave me a leg up a lot more life experience

but then also knowledge and know how to and a lot more drive

because at that point I was already out of home

so I’m like well

I’ve got the motivation I need income

I need my paycheck so you get the last one

yeah I got expenses

so it’s like well

you know I hustled and I did a lot of work after hours too

so like throughout my apprenticeship

I do my it’s called 7:30 till 4

and then I’d go

often go to maintenance projects or jobs after hours or weekends

also in seven days for for quite a while

and I think that really helps

you know sort of progress to where we are now

where do you think that hustle comes from

cause not everyone loves you know

working seven days a week or

you know putting in the hours

do you did you just have that from a young age

or was it something you built up

I think so yeah

I think from young age

cause I still remember I even was super young and all like yeah

go around like

especially during school holidays on whatever day it was

Wednesday mornings or so

and go through people’s recycle bins and pick

up in the cans

and then by the end of the school holidays

you end up you know

with like a trailer load or so and cash it in

and yeah it was all by weight

and so you need a lot of cans to get a minimal amount

yeah I think you’re just having that drive

I’m not so money motivated

but I just like working and I think

and that’s where probably carpentry has LED me and into construction

is that I have a real passion and love for

for this industry so it just makes

you know going to work so much easier too

yeah definitely

did you fall in love with it straight away

like how how early on did you know that you wanted to be a builder

yes I think probably in high school

maybe around like the use of nine year 10

and it’s very typical you know

everyone goes out I love working with hands

seeing the outcome the finished product

but that was pretty much it

you know through woodwork

and you tell us like alright

well this is what I enjoy

and I was quite fortunate to knowing that

and I took like I said

you sort of took the university path

whereas some of my other friends went to vet VCA

what did you study at university

was it was it yes I did Bachelor of business Bachelor okay yeah yeah

so my

my major was like e commerce management

and with a minor in marketing

so that was always like the sort of set myself up for

to either be like on wages

but still stick within construction and ideally run my own business

do you reckon a lot of that

a lot of that skill set that you Learned at uni has definitely helped

with the business side that a lot of carpenters

and I guess builders definitely struggle with

is the that’s most of the phone calls that I get around business

and that’s something I’ve always got to help out with

so yeah do you think that having that sort of background

definitely has given you a leg up

absolutely yeah

I think subconsciously back then nowadays it’s conscious

it’s natural and I think you’re right

a lot of

all business owners never really got taught how to run a business

how to grow and it’s so

you know

especially cause you get so caught up working that sort of on site

just you know

just taking over

no one’s actually sort of sitting back and working on the business

so I think that’s it’s key

and that’s where I think if you can assist people

that’s where they need help at the moment

what about for yourself how many days a week are you

are you spending seven days a week on the business

are you a you know

you in the office four days a week five days a week

what’s what’s it look like as you know a director

it’s got you know multiple jobs happening at the same time yes

so I’m probably try to be in the office

but depending on the weeks and where the projects are at

or what sort comes in on my schedule

it does dictate

but I still try to keep it somewhat a little bit of routine

like Mondays are generally the busiest because we get yeah

sort of setting up for the week yeah

recap and then the week in query

so I try to do a lot of office time Mondays

and then generally Wednesdays and then Fridays

I still love to do site runarounds site checkups

and then generally it’s like a Tuesday or Thursday

like quoting client meetings

bits and pieces but I think yeah

the more time I spend in the office I’m a lot more efficient too

so and II feel that because when I’m on site

I’m just on the computer I’m like yeah

you get distracted or you wait I think the way you know

I know I’m not as efficient as I can be

and that kind of upsets me too yeah

where’s like in the office

I got multiple screens it’s computer

so I’m there and I can focus to less instructions and

and do you have your own like your own space as well

your own office space or is it

is it at home or is it factory or

so we’ve got an office factory in Box Hill South

yep and so

so factory downstairs where we can

we store a lot of our I guess equipment

and that’s probably the biggest difference as well

coming from carpenter to builder

there’s yeah a lot of extra tools equipment

you know assets that you need just to run the site

which unfortunately you have to store somewhere too

so in between projects

or as you have some projects at different stages that come and go

and then we’ve got like a mezzanine office upstairs

which do you think having your own space definitely helps with

like you said the focus

the organisation sort of making sure that you stay on track

yes yeah

and I think it gives you that drive as well to get out well

and it’s also presentable to a lot of clients

cause we’ll have client meetings

especially we’re sort of

we’re pricing projects or running through with client meetings

I often invite them to the office

and we’ll just sit down and we’ll run through

you know other proposals or potentially that new lead

and I think it just shows that professionalism too

yeah well yes

we are level up from the

I guess the home office builder or the one man show

and that’s also reflected in

in the service and the value that we can offer

and then also the price so I know we’re not the cheapest

but then we offer a lot more value yeah

I guess no one wants to be the cheapest

well that’s the idea

isn’t it yeah

I mean some days it feels like there’s a race to the bottom

yeah and that’s where a lot of the sort of unqualified industries are

but I think you know

with carpentry like

you know we keep trying to push it up

you know because it is a skill and we want a lot of

a lot of carpenters to be recognized for the time and the effort

and then also the knowledge on site too

yeah because in the day

the carpenters are there right from say demolition

right to handover why do you think are carpenters

I guess the most unappreciated in the trade in terms of

you know wages

and it seems like a lot of the people that I talk to

you know

you are there from the beginning all the way through to the end

and there’s a lot of things that don’t happen

without carpenters

on site so where

where do you think that comes from

and where when does this pay disparity

you know end

yeah so maybe it comes from

I guess you know

being a builder and then carpenter by trade

but then all of our carpenters under us

just end up being like a builder’s carpenter almost

so the idea the intent

is we just need the project to keep moving

and unfortunately that’s where the carpenters like

you know if they’re in house or the contract

they’re always available and they’re generally so it’s like

can you do this can you do that

and it’s outside of the carpentry skill set

but again you’re looking at the project schedule

you know we need it moving

so I think that’s just where

you know they just get lumped with a lot of tasks

and try to just keep it moving

but unfortunately I think with the pay

because they are seeing right throughout the job

and it makes it hard

because when you start seeing carpenter invoices and then your costs

which just blow out throughout the project

whereas you have plumbers

electricians even other specialized trades

they just come in and out

so I mean even though they’re on a high rate

it’s probably not as noticeable

yes there’s carpenters out there too

yeah OK

for like the whole quoting process

I’m always interested to hear how different businesses

sort of manage that side

so you get your inquiries to do a bulk of them come

I’m through just through like Instagram or your website

or is it word of mouth so yeah

majority of our work is referrals

yep or sort of repeat customers

so with that like we’ve got plenty

we’ve got a couple of clients that I like

we keep going back on stage 4

stage 5 and that’s just yeah

over the couple years you know

we’ll renovate or we’ll do a task

and then we’re back the next year and following on

or we just stick with them

and then we stay within their family

and we’ve got another client that will do work for their house

but then also their family house and then you

know

other siblings

so it’s really nice when when it’s sort of we keep within that

but then we still get a few new leads come through

and I think off you’re trying to show what value you have

sometimes it’s what you know

it’s probably the hardest part about the project

and then you’re winning that client too

because some clients are just looking on price

and trying to distinguish you kind of well

what they actually need is you know

to understand that their overall proposal

because if you just look at price

I think you’re gonna make the wrong decision too sometimes

I was gonna say like how do you differentiate you know

like you’re putting up putting together a quote or a tender

whatever it might be

how do you sort of showcase to the to the client that it

you know

that the price is what it is because of the quality of the work

and there might be some cheaper quotes out there

but they’re not necessarily gonna do things to the level of detail

and is that sort of what you end up

sort of in yeah

I think a lot of it is always set from when they get their quotes

their proposals in because no doubt

you know some clients will get a one page quote saying

as per plans and here’s the price

whereas we really break down our proposals

and we’ll have other site meetings

client meetings and sometimes we even bring in like

trades and get them on site just to formalize their quote

and but our proposal will broken down per trade or sometimes per room

depending what the project is

yeah and so yeah

potentially our proposal can be

you know 20

30 pages and it’s you know

try to break it down almost per step per key item for each task

and then I think at least that way they can start saying well

if he’s if we’re putting in this much detail and attention

right from the start just for a proposal

then that will translate to the detail on site too

and was that something that you Learned over time

or did you get it from another builder

or is it you know

I know that you’ve actually done a lot of upskilling yourself

and you’re very interested in

in continuously learning about things

so did it come from any kind of yeah

any kind of coverage that you had or like

where did this sort of process start

yeah I think it was more just about trying to make things easier

more simplified and then also

you know just a better outcome for the client

so we used to use a couple different software packages

and then as we’ve grown as well

or as I want more and then we keep looking elsewhere and we

we find new software packages got a really good one at the moment

but even even that

I still want using for the full house of capability that has

so we’re across a couple different programs well

what do you use you’re welcome to there’s no yes

so for our on site project management

yeah client portal we’ve got builder trend yeah

which is sort of American based yeah

high expense

but well worth it and then for our proposals we use one to build yeah

and then accounting software use zero yeah

so I know some of them yeah

you can still double up and we

we do pay premium because I’m sure we could use one platform

to generally cover a lot of that

but this is kind of what works for me yeah OK yeah

I think that works I was gonna say as well

so we’ve we’ve

I’ve heard of one before and I haven’t heard of the American one

but I know that there’s plenty of businesses out there that use

you know they might have four or five different

softwares that they use for their business

and sometime they’re not necessarily getting the value out of it

that they they might need

you know for take offs or if it’s for their timesheets

whatever it might be what was it within your business that showed that

that it was worth the money for what you were getting

and it sort of what was it saving your time on certain things as well

like yeah so that the big this shift

which one we moved to build train

was more about how can we better the overall project

and that’s where that schedule contractors clients

even our in house system so the advantage

I think with builder trim is that there’s different aspects

so from you know sort of subbie to subbie work

it’s it’s all there

so we upload their details and we just schedule them

they get notifications as soon as we book them

and then they get the the prime notification as well

we expect them to do like daily logs and that’s images description

so that helps us with our scheduling

and then we can see on the project are we on track

you know where are they at

what did they get sort of completed for the day

and then one of the other biggest features was like the client portal

so for any of our clients

like they can see lifetime the actual schedule

yeah it’s got its own personalised email inbox

so like for our each of our projects customise inbox

so at least we’re not losing you know

missing emails or things like that

too and there’s also a sort of documents and file share too

so from our perspective one platform generally in house

which helps the on site project management yeah

that helps and we use Dropbox for our cloud base which yeah

we’ve got a lot of data

and just because of all the projects that we take

thousands of photos throughout the job

so we’ve always been very meticulous about photo taking

and documentation

and cause there’s so many people out there

that are not in a pad and

you know they take a few photos and then that’s sort of that’s it

you know is that just always been I think record keeping

yeah is is big one for me

I like to be systemized organized

and I think that’s where like say scheduling

I mean I love it like

and that’s where one of my windows on my computer is just

you know it’s the schedule and I just alternate per job

but being able to see and I have to look at it in like a monthly view

as opposed to a Gantt chart or a list

like for some reason

I just I like to see per per month and I can see each day from there

but then that really helps just to stay on track

and then you forecast any potential lead time issues

or making sure that we’re on track too

and keep accountability for people

what do you think is the biggest hurdle for

for carpenters in terms of getting organized

like what’s something some

for coming from someone who’s extremely

organized

what what’s something

what’s a tip that you can give that if they sorted it out

it’ll save them time you know

exponentially this potentially could be technology

I mean everyone’s got a phone but so how much do you use

yeah is is it more so just for social media phone calls

text messages or using it

you know for what it has the options yeah

like you know

like all our sub trades we just expect them to use an app

so one one single app

but then they’ve got this whole um

program software where it just unleashes all those forms so yeah

I think that really increases productivity too

because they can see schedules

they’re not showing up to a site

you know

we go this is not ready because they can see our schedule go up well

they know that a previous trade was in the day before

you know so today

you know it is ready for them or it’s just them on site

we know there’s multiple trades

so I think yeah I get efficiency helps yeah

and I think it more you can share with yourself traits uh

project benefits from that too

so it helps you communicate better as well

yeah yeah

communication is a big one yeah

yeah and even like trade to trade and and then for us

it’s more so the client communication and we

we like to try to be really important with that

and that’s why I think the customised inbox

it helps because then you know

those those clients know that we’re responding to them as well

and then yeah we should just work towards it

now look

I hate to say it

but I am a bit of a fan of the block

ha ha ha

and I I loved the season that you guys were on

II was watching it pretty intently

what was obviously we didn’t we didn’t get all the way to the end

you know there’s always dramas on the block

and we’ve had people in the past that gone on it

they gone off and look it’s

it’s we’ve had everything happen

you know

so what was your wanna know what your experience was like on it

and you know

did you

has there been some other opportunities to come after that that

you know might not have been there

yes so the block was

I mean it was great opportunity because and that’s where I think

you know surprising to some people that you can’t apply for as builder

so the contestants have to approach as yourself

and then you get the opportunity

so I’ve always said previously no

I wouldn’t do it whether it’s your work commitments

timing or even if sort of the

the outside of work your family commitments too

but

opportunity came up and you know

we sort of had a team discussion and like alright

well we’ll give it a crack

so I mean I think yeah

apart from the longer hours and

you know the intensity

which is what we’re always

you know thrive on anyway

we’re quite used to but I think we overall we really enjoyed it

and I think yeah

Gabriel if the opportunity was there

you’d be silly not to take it

we were quite fortunate we already had some opportunities prior with

with TV and then you know

different sort of programs and then after as well

like we’ve got some really good contacts

yeah

within that industry yeah

and I think it’s just another stepping stone and I mean

you know to

to be able to say you’ve been a block builder

I mean a great

just the the portfolio too

yeah definitely

definitely so even

even from an optics point of view

it’s still good yes

yeah absolutely

yeah and I know it didn’t go

you know the way that we wanted

like we would love to see progress from start to finish

yeah so it was a little bit disappointing that we sort of

you know we got subbed out halfway

but then again you know

that open the opportunity for

for another builder yeah

to employ the project and then I still had dramas after the thing

yeah so it didn’t matter

no I was winning yeah

I love it I love it well you think you did really well and you won

you won some awards on there as well for like the best room

and I think the past workers on site and stuff as well

so you was obviously appreciated in different ways yeah

absolutely yeah

and I think you know being able to sort of bring our skill set

and the methodology of the way we do some tasks

because even Keith and Dan

hadn’t you sort of seen the way we did a couple of the tasks

and I and that was an improvement for them as well

and that’s what they then incorporated for the rest of the houses

so being able to bring that and you know

the long days because we’d have to sort get there

you know 6 o’clock in the morning for a park and then you know

the guys would finish at six PM

and then you’re depending on what’s required

Mark myself would I just stay after or yeah

I’m trying to try to limit at that yeah

no and let the contestants do that almost the night shift

yeah and we’re back again and you know six days a week for well

I couldn’t believe that they changed all that this year

they at you know that they locked the site at like 6 o’clock

they only let them work till ten PM or eleven PM some nights

it was it’s completely different

from sort of how hard they made them go a couple years ago

but yeah good experience overall

yeah absolutely yeah

well we’ve got some other sort of community

stuff that we’ve been able to do

and I think I’ve always wanted to include DPB in it

I think there’s been a couple of jobs that have come up

where it hasn’t sort of worked out timing wise

but I know that we’ll we’ll get one in soon

do you like to do stuff for the community and you know

for your sort of

I know you do stuff in the court for your for your kids for the

for the families that are around you mate

can you tell us a little bit about that

yeah so we we do a little bit with Gateway Land as well

which is generally like work experience for a lot of year 10 students

so we take on and we generally have them throughout the whole year

work experience so it’s one day a week

now we’ve got a student

and it’s just offering that industry experience

and they also do a lot of a lot of

I call it like sort of speed X days where

you know

like the students come from different schools and they meet you

like a bunch of you know

maybe 30 40 different professionals from different industries

and we just have a chat and it’s like 6

seven minutes at a time and they just work work around

it’s like round table scenario

and it’s great because we love to give back to the industry

and I think yes

a lot of students can can do 10 days in an industry and go out

is this for me is it not

I think it’s a it’s a fantastic learning curve for them

because we’ve had students that come in as

thinking they wanna do carpentry

but now they wanna be in construction and then sometimes I’ll be like

no carpentry is not for me

maybe it’s electrician maybe it’s plumber and then again

it’s been the other way around

we’ve had people that come in originally

I’ve done work experience with plumbing

but now I’m thinking I wanna go towards carpentry

that’s cool that’s cool and how long you’ve been doing that for

I think we probably about last eight eight or nine years so yeah yeah

so long quite a long time again

it’s off and on a little bit throughout the terms

and sort of what students are available

but it’s great for us because it gives us a

it was like they’re good feels

but it’s also really good

we pair them up a lot with our carpenters or you know

sometimes our apprentices and it just yeah

it helps them with their personal growth too

yeah cause then they’re looking after another student

they’re thinking for themselves and someone

else

so without a lot of the pressure

you know it’s not like

you know the work experience is working with

you know the boss or someone like that and the expectations too high

yeah that they get the chance to really sit down with the carpenter

and learn and

you know chat and then really progress through that way well

not many people would notice

but Dave’s actually

has attended multiple different trade schools with us as well

over the years and I think

we’re very appreciative that we’ve been able to have a member

sort of in the in the flesh with us at

you know Melbourne Polytechnic and

you know Box Hill Institute

and I think there’s been a couple times at Swinburne and stuff as well

SO

all the different schools that we’re associated with here in Victoria

alone and yeah

like

for you to be able to take time out of your day to sort of come down

you know kid him out with some of your own

you even got some of your own and something about branding

stuff that apprentices love

but also just talking about

you know your experiences in the trade and sort of

you know instilling the it’s

it’s a great industry for them to be in and

you know you’re there to support them as well

and I think we’ve even said

you know if there’s any apprentices that were keen

we might have had a couple

no we

we did actually have one I

don’t know if he’s still with you now

but we did have an apprentice that came from Melbourne Poly

that started working with you guys

and it was a good fit

has he gone to finish his friendship

yes so that was Josh and yes

so he finished friendship with us yeah

and then yes stay on as qualified carpenter

and we sort of kept him for a few years

and then he’s decided to move on

but there was a great opportunity and it worked for both parties

I think he sort of liked where we’ve come from what we were doing

and he wants to get into the renovation space

so it was perfect yeah

perfect that’s it yeah

I’m glad we were able to do that as well yeah

definitely works both ways yeah

so what do you think about where the industry is going

and is there is there any sort of tidbits that you

that you see happening over the next couple of years

I like to still see carpenters keep progressing I mean

I don’t think it’s gonna be like a licensed trade overall

but I think that there’s a lot more worth with carpentry now

whereas apparently I like previously

I think that the mindset was

you’re a carpenter and you’re towards at bottom

because you’re again

you’re on site pay scale things like that

but I think there’s movement and again

you know carpenters like you know

because they’re on projects that they know all tasks and

and you do majority of them

it’s like well

they need to be remunerated and rewarded for it too

so I think if we can keep pushing carpentry

and that’s also in a few so programs and then so associations too

to back that then I think

you know then we’ll be on a level playing field as well

and have a lot more respect within yeah

I think you’re right

you mentioned before about sort of pricing and the fact that

you know plumbers and electricians

they might come in they

they’re only sort of there for a short period of time

and they get paid more

there is that sort of pay disparity

but you’re you’re right

like a carpenter might get three months worth of work out of

you know a job

whereas you know

a plumber might only be there for a couple of days and then yeah

and then they’ve got to move on to the next job

they gotta keep quoting and stuff

so yeah I

I guess you’re right in saying that

they’re on site for a longer period of time

but it doesn’t mean that they can’t be paid

more

no that’s right yeah

cause in the end of the day

everyone’s goal is to work

you know throughout the year

so it’s not like say a plumber or electrician only working

you know two days a week

and so if everyone’s working five days a week

well then

you know why aren’t the carpenters at the same rate yeah

I understand there’s a lot more licensing and

insurances

but you know I think

you know at least

you know be sort of a little bit more sort of yeah

closer together yeah

with the pay scales

what do you think of some of the events that you’ve been to

over the years you know

for for builders and for for

have you have you sort of met some good people

through some of these networking things that you’ve gone to yeah

absolutely and I think

I’ve still got a few

sort of network groups that I’m a related with as well

but I think the biggest change in the mindset

that a lot of people don’t see

is that if I can go out to breakfast with a few other builders like

yeah we’re all in the same sort of space like we’re in construction

but yeah I could be renovation

someone else could be new builds

someone else could be extensions whatever it may be

but we’re seeing it almost like collaboration

like we’re working together as opposed to competition

I think that’s always really good in that way but for some people yeah

like they don’t wanna be seen with another builder yeah

it’s just yeah whatever that mindset is got through yeah

I think you know

if if you’re there to help each other

cause in the day the industry is very small

and that’s what I tell a lot of the sort of

carpenters too

and then one of the other advantages is that we share a lot of our

trade contacts between our house builders

so could be someone’s in need of a

another vendor or a different electrician

kind of go well yes

we can vouch for this electrician

we use them or no

you know I would recommend this person again

and I think having that inside knowledge

and just that group you get really helps within

you know

ensuring that each project is delivered until high outcome too

yeah OK

I just wanna talk about

one thing that I thought was really fascinating

obviously the last time I saw you

you were you were a little bit heftier

ha ha ha

you know it’s sort of

you’re different not you

you know the people but like you

you’ve leaned up quite a lot and I’m impressed

and I feel half of you looking in

you know it’s hard to run the business

I’m always talking to our boys about you know

being able to run a business

but then being able to look after themselves as well

so like if you got any other kind of tips or tricks or you know

any kind of advice for people that wanna stay healthy as well

you know as a builder yes

I think I mean the hardest thing is probably as a builder

sort of start shifting more towards the office space

I mean like I know growing up was always like

I wanna be outside working my hands and then unfortunately

–

just natural progression pushes you towards that office role

and I think yeah it’s like well

one or two is gonna give isn’t it

so you either try to push back and go stay on site

put office workers in or you go out well

take the role of the office work

but then you gotta keep working on yourself

and that’s where I realised I need to keep focusing on myself

and I think it was a bit more routine structure

and then just my own space too

so I could yeah almost clock off and just you know

just worry about myself for a for a bit

so and then you know about timing wise

it was like I can’t can’t squeeze it in during the day

can’t squeeze it in at night

so where’s the time so just gotta wake up earlier

so yeah so generally the other one goes up at 4:00am and up and out

and then so

I can still sort of go train

and then to be on site

or back in the office by the time everyone else starts their day

yeah yeah

so OK

and you feel like you are get used to it

are you used to it now yeah

yeah absolutely

I think yeah

I think most traders always like to start it

but it’s just how early that is their alarm clock going off

because I remember used to sort of post sometimes on social be like

yeah if I was leaving before 5

you know it always be like the early bird gets the worm scenario

yeah and now it’s just almost like a stock standard day

but it’s just a different mentality

and I think yeah

if you’re working on yourself

then it’s reflected yeah

in multiple aspects too so

because I know I’ve worked on myself

so then I think my performance at work is also increased

and then also my family as well

so there’s some great benefits across the board

and how do you manage having a family now

you got a couple of kids and

you know you obviously love being a dad

so how do you manage like the business side of things as well as

you know being

being good to your family and trying to look after them

yes I think the weekend’s probably been the biggest shift

like I

said previously coming from like say seven days a week and I was 6

and now

I’ve really tried to sort of minimize the amount of weekend work I do

and sometimes it’s still a bit

little bit of sort of computer work on the weekends

but there’s less client meetings

less sort of quoting things like that because with my restructure

I can do a lot of that during the week

so it’s a lot more better time management

and then saying that there’s there’s the after work commitments too

now I’m so like I got swimming lessons

things like that we got dancing like my wife

she does hell of a lot so yep

she sort of generally looks after the family and all those commitments

because I don’t unfortunately

I don’t have like a regular home time

which would be nice but yeah

people taking whether I’m coming from site or from the office

I can I can chop and change every day

yeah so I mean

I think that would be really good from their perspective if they knew

right I’ll be home at this time regularly

but I’m trying yeah

I’m working towards that and I think yeah

that would be you know

almost a goal for next year

is to sort of start setting a few more family oriented goals

yeah along with work too

because I think we can deliver more

you know within the same sort of time period too now

when I don’t say to you

do you have a search for me with you

followed forth for those things you have

like a big dog and you’re losing something else

that you’ve seen it all

there’s nothing

I used to be really aggressive

and I think that was almost here before you had a lot to lose as well

the times are different like

you know I remember like 2018 19 we pushed

the business pretty hard back then things did seem a lot easier too yep

but yeah I look like I was still a registered builder back then yeah we had more carpenters on the books yeah

things were just easy

whereas nowadays there’s a lot more systems and processes involved

but we still yeah we work towards that and it was very simple question

oh yeah do you like goal setting

like do you like what

how do you set your goals

and sort of what’s the best way to set yourself up for success

so with with goals

we try to review them annually and generally

as most people would be over Christmas break

where you can kind of you take a minute

see where you finished up the previous year

and then where you wanna be for the next year

I think one of the biggest shifts was almost like writing them down

because then they’re out there

and if you discuss them with people

whether it’s family friends

business partners whatever

maybe it’s a little bit more accountability on yourself too for

whereas if you just kind of have them mentally in your mind

you know it’s like

oh well yeah

did you reach them or you got I got three quarters away there

that’s alright you can be happy where you can settle

whereas I think if you can be accountable

like we’ve got a blackboard at home

which try to put them on sort of a few personal goals

and then the business ones are slightly

different there as well yeah

but I think yeah

our aim is really keep pushing and it’s not so much about turnover

like some people just want to see growth that way

but I think you know

it’s it’s more about the value if you go well during the year like

you know the jobs are running smoothly

client satisfaction is high

your team satisfaction your culture’s there

and you can always clock off on a Friday

and not have a problem over the weekend yeah

I think that really shows yeah

your company growth because for some reason

like it always used to happen like Friday afternoon

so there’d be some sort of issue question email phone call

whatever it is and you get it just playing your mind all weekend

do you think that the margins come as well

so like a lot of people are worried about turnover and they’re like

look if I just I just have more jobs more jobs

you know that that means that I’m gonna make more money and like

you know in layman’s terms it seems like that would be the case

but do you think that even having sort

of smaller jobs that are going on

or being more meticulous about what you’re actually doing

that you you can actually still make more money

you know within that space or you know

you’ve got less risk involved

like how do you say it yes

I think it’s sort of both ways because you can be

you can run smaller jobs and you still have the same

same markup as a larger project

but if you’re comfortable in that space

you know you’re gonna be a lot more efficient

and your schedule’s gonna run on time

your client satisfaction’s gonna be there

do we’ve got a few bathrooms and laundries on at the moment

and it kind of just runs like clockwork in the background yes

I was talking to a client today and she’s like

she’s like impressed about how it’s run so far and it’s just you know

things have stuck to the schedule

we had to you know adjust them

you know here and there but for probably most of it like

you know we’ve sort of

we’ve kept to it timelines are on track

and then we start the next sort of stage 2 the following week

so I think with that yes

you can still do really well staying within your lane yes

that’s the way we sort of like to pitch it

so without going to a larger project

and then you’ve been uncomfortable there or swamped

but then you also need that

uncomfortable zone to be able to push yourself

yeah that’s true

yeah cause I mean

I think I was happy being comfortable and you know

well I want growth and so

and everyone knows you got to be outside your comfort zone for that

but how far do you extend

that’s probably that is a balancing act

and I think you almost got to overstep and go alright

well maybe that worked out maybe it didn’t flipped it

I don’t know but you kind of work out where the sweet spot is yeah

and that sort of comes out to nishing a little bit

like if you know your market’s renovations

renovation and extensions like us stick with that

you know like we don’t really touch new builds

we don’t do a lot of anything work or anything like that

we don’t do commercial real estate

yep we know renovations and generally I tell clients

especially new leads if they’ve got like internal brick walls masonry

that’s that’s us like in a city like down a thoroughfare

that’s sort of our specialty yeah

I think that that really helps cause then our team our subbies

you know our internal team are all aligned

and it just helps

because we can go in there already being a step ahead yeah

that’s true that’s true

if you’ve got if you already got that skill set and you spent so long

you know building up the the repertoire of of all these renos

and stuff that you’re you know

it’s your specialty you know

you’ve got these people out there that spend their whole lives

building these unbelievable decks

you know you wouldn’t call them and say hey

put this so this new build

uh this commercial restaurant that I want you to so it’s just you yeah

you wouldn’t necessarily do that

so you think that’s important for businesses that

to have their own sort of specialty or to sort of stay in their lane

and if they really wanna do something well

that’s sort of the way to do it

yeah absolutely

I think you sort of nailed it

you go well

if you can stay where you know

where you wanna be because you enjoy it more too

yeah and then I think the efficiency comes

you know your subcontractors are comfortable with it as well

because we’ve built up

like a lot of our subcontractors will be renovation based

but they’ve got a few that will step outside and yeah

well we

they know the expectation

the housekeeping the level of finish the requirements of the project

and so it just runs a whole lot smoother

yeah I love it

what any exciting stuff before the end of the year

what else have you got coming up or is

is there

anything you’re struggling about next year

that you guys gonna be starting

yeah so we’re sort of

we’re working through documentation for a major brand name

for a project in Glen Iris okay

and yeah

it’s been we’ve worked on it for probably the last 12 months finally

so I see some concepts come through okay

and it’s really exciting

so the client’s brief was a lot of natural light originally

so we’ve gone back and forth

just tweaked a little bit yeah

bit of value management there but I think overall

but it’s it’s gonna be stunning and it looks out to back reserve

so they’re gonna get a lot of beautiful views that way yeah

and gazing white comes through so

and how long do you reckon you’ll be on it

if like when that jobs comes through yeah

so I think we’ll probably stage it it’ll be around seven

nine 12 months okay and it’s a full Reno

so we’ll touch the front half of the house

kind of just gets a makeover and the back is

you know always like chop it off cut it and then yeah

full extension from there yeah

so I love it so that’ll be one of the big ones

and we still take on a lot of supplementary projects

so a lot of small like bathrooms and yeah

might be just a little extension things like that

it’s come in and you know

like workshop it and that’s probably the hardest thing

like we used to be able to get jobs like Lisa come through

and be able to start on site within a couple of months

but now everything seems to take like 6 12 months whatever it is

but get governed by you know what project size too

do you think it’s good to have like a good a pipeline of work

like do you try and stay booked out for that six to 12 months

or you know you said you do little supplementary jobs and stuff

but I guess you got the crew so it allows you to

I do these little jobs on the side as well

yeah yeah

correct and that’s probably the hardest thing as well

because we know carpenters

you know they can be on site for probably the whole project

but then there’s there’s points where you don’t need carpenters

and if you got a new house

where do you send them

so we’re fortunate enough again with this sort of builder network

like we also contract and labour hire out to each other

just to get you to help out

you know even if it might not align with our

schedules

but one of the other builders needs a hand

we’ll just help him out there too yeah

but by having a couple little projects come in

you schedule them and you go oh

it works out beautifully yeah

transition and German people think

you know little ones are better for cash flow

I mean it’s true

like you can set up progress stage payments that it does align

and you can you can get the cash in a bit quicker

but I mean small project small progress payments

so it doesn’t really help you solve the issue

but it’s just a chance to turn over to there

I think the one of the things I wanted to finish with is you’re you

you have been a member since I think 2017 or 2016

so it’s been a long time and since I started at CA back in 2018

I’ve always seen your name pop up

and we’ve done a lot of stuff together out on site

but what do you think the most

sort of crucial thing is that you’ve been able to

gain from

you know being a member with Carpentry Australia over the years

and what’s something you hope to see in the future from us

this is probably one of the biggest advantages

that real will assistance was back in Covid

yeah I know it’s going back a few years

but there was a lot of no sports turns

and just updates that you guys were sending out

whether it was weekly daily as they came through

you know like you’re emailing out to all the members

and that was fantastic because for us

like we weren’t sure where the regulations were at

where the rules were at because

you know being renovations

like we couldn’t work in a lot of homes and they were occupied

so that clarity that came through Carpenter Australia really helps

we’re affiliated with a few other industry bodies

but there was seems to be a bit more lag time with that

so you guys were right on it

and I think that really helped us

and it’s always been it’s been fantastic

so yeah keep your head and I think for the future I mean

I just I want to see you know

more and more carpenters jump on board and become members

because I think you know

the industry needs it too

and again it’s it’s all about that

it’s almost like a builder network

if we can have carpenter network where you can share carpenters

because we’re we’re constantly looking just for you know

decent subways too yeah

carpenters because you know projects always need a push and uh yeah

and then you once you get through that

then you can ease back and if there’s Carpenter Australia can offer

you know this vast variety of of carpenters on hand alright

well yes yeah he’s a he’s a list he can choose great yeah

it solves everyone’s needs

well I think that that’s something that we’re very excited about

is that the new member portal is

we had sort of our part 1 member portal

and that sort of to start of this year

and we’ve seen all of this

all of the bugs and all of the sort of little

issues that we were having within the website

and there’s like a 2.0 that’s coming

I think towards the end of this year is when

when it’s gonna be live but it’ll have exactly that

it’ll have its own sort of

list of carpenters that you can go through

on the find a Carpenter page

they’ll be job leads there’ll be job listings as well

so if it’s general public

or if it’s other builders that are looking for people

and it’ll just allow people to actually

you know if you if you ever need anything

you can hop on and you know

that there’s 20 blokes that are actually open to work

and they’re in your area so that’s it

will you just hit them out of it

ha ha ha sensational yeah

I love it well

thanks for thanks for coming in

and actually before we go

Halloween set up for this year mate

oh yeah we got some some special stuff this year

there’s some more staff and yes

yes so you get going big yeah

going big bigger yeah

well probably similar size

I haven’t bought so too many new things

OK I’m just trying to add in an extra

so we’re adding like last year we did like

we hide like a little cotton candy machine yeah

this year we added in like a little photo booth yeah

so like you know

when you go like a weddings or I can yeah

you can get like you jump in the photo booth

you get the print out three photos

so we’re doing that as well

and then yeah

still be like amazed the smoke machines and all that stuff

but last year I think for the four hours we had

it was just under 15 kids

yes that’s crazy

so yeah I think unfortunately being Friday night this year

I think it’s gonna be more

but yeah yeah

like we I did an online order for lollies yeah

I worked on about you know

I think it’s like 3,800 or something

so I’ve I’ve given some bags to my neighbours yeah

because I feel sorry because

you know they get slammed as much as we do

oh yeah

yeah so

I mean you know

we try to give a lot of kids

you know like every kid like one lolly

but you know

it’s like the kids are just one as many as yeah

that’s right I’m trying to grab handfuls of pears

I’m looking forward to it yeah

so super excited yeah

it’s a it’s a big event

especially for one night yeah

that’s right well

that I wanna see the best sort of Halloween display in the southeast

you can you can come hit up Dave

he’s got some unbelievable stuff

also fantastic builder

fantastic and just that

we’re really happy that we’ve

been able to build this relationship over the years mate

and thanks so much for coming in and talking to us

no problems thank you you’re a legend